Interview With the President Question-and-Answer Session With Black Media Representatives.

MR. AGURS. Good morning, Mr. President. As I said, I'm Don Agurs of the Mutual Black Network. And I'd like to congratulate you, first of all, on your award of the 1979 Martin Luther King, Jr. Nonviolent Peace Prize and thank you for this opportunity to talk with you today.

THE PRESIDENT. Well, that's a great honor for me, and I look forward to being in Atlanta with Mrs. King and the others who admire not only what Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.'s life meant while he was with us but what it still means and will mean in the future.

Thank you very much, Don.

UNEMPLOYMENT

MR. AGURS. My first question, Mr. President, is, in the last days of his life, Dr. King became an active campaigner for economic justice in addition to civil rights, as we witnessed the poor people's campaign and his final effort in Memphis. Among his stated goals was a job for everyone willing to work. Now, even with the Humphrey-Hawkins bill on the books, such as it is, it now seems likely that unemployment next year is bound to creep upward again as the economy slows down.

My question is, aside from the allowances in the anti-inflation program, should not there be a greater emphasis on retaining the job-creating measures in the 1980 budget, at least at the current level, if you accept the caucus' premise that unemployment in the black community is already in a crisis state?

THE PRESIDENT. Well, I think our record so far on employment, unemployment, has been very good. In the last 2 years, we've added a net increase of about 7 million jobs in our country and have cut down the unemployment rate by more than 25 percent.

Between the 1978 and 1979 fiscal year budgets, we added about $4 billion to specific programs for the poor. And between this year and next year, the new budget, we'll add about that much more, a little more than $4 billion in increased programs for the poor.

In addition, we've tried to concentrate on job opportunities for minority groups, not just in public service employment, which is temporary and transient at best, but stable, permanent jobs, primarily in the private sector. And we've had especially good support from the Congress so far in providing these job opportunities in minority-owned businesses.

And, of course, for the 1980 fiscal year budget, which has not yet been revealed, I can tell you that we'll have another substantial increase in the allocation of public funds for this purpose. Even in the general areas of bank investments of Federal funds, we've increased those in black and other minority-owned banks.

We have allocated large portions of our total purchases for the Federal Government to minority-owned businesses. And in the $4 billion public works program, between 10 and 15 percent of that total allocation of contracts has gone to minority-owned businesses—I think about 3,500 black-owned businesses have benefited from that.

We are still dedicated to carrying out the purposes espoused by Dr. King, and also we were very eager to help in the passage of the Humphrey-Hawkins bill.

I might say one other thing just in passing. It's equally important to poor people and to minorities not to have their earnings and what they own sapped away by rapidly rising inflation. So, I wouldn't want the anti-inflation program to be characterized as being against poor people. Those who suffer most from rampant inflation are those who have very low incomes and those who are retired or otherwise have a limited income and can't move from one job to another.

So, I think a proper balancing of anti-inflation efforts, to which we are dedicated, with an increase in job opportunities, to which we are dedicated, is the best approach.

MR. AGURS. Our next question will come from Ms. Allen.

MARTIN LUTHER KING, JR.

Ms. ALLEN. Mr. President, Vicki Allen from the National Black Network. Does your administration plan to back the bill that will create a national holiday for the late Dr. Martin Luther King?

THE PRESIDENT. Yes. This is in the Democratic National Party platform, and we would very much—I would like to sign a bill, passed by the Congress, to have this done.

Ms. ALLEN. Thank you.

MR. AGURS. Mr. Briscoe.

MINORITY-OWNED PUBLISHING FIRMS

MR. BRISCOE. Mr. President, I'm Sherman Briscoe from the National Newspaper Publishers Association. As you know, the first amendment rights have prohibited the Small Business Administration-that is, it has interpreted it as so in its regulations—not to make insured loans to communications media. That was true with respect to electronic media until recently, but now it does insure loans to electronic media to buy stations, to build towers, to buy and install equipment. What do you think of having the prohibition removed with respect to small newspapers and minority newspapers, where they, too, could obtain loans, insured loans, from the Small Business Administration to buy presses and equipment and this kind of thing?

THE PRESIDENT. In addition to what you've described, we, through the Federal Communications Commission, have encouraged the allocation of radio and television licenses to minority-owned corporations. I think it would be very helpful if we could have small business-type loans made available to the owners or potential purchasers of newspapers, if the courts can work out a way to protect any dominance or unwarranted influence by the Government on those publishers and editors, who ought to have a free right to speak their own voices in the publishing field.

So, if that one concern can be alleviated, I think it would be very helpful to have loans made to either expand black-owned publishing firms or to let black-owned corporations or others buy into the publishing field.

MR. BRISCOE. Would you suggest how the black press might go about obtaining this kind of relaxing of the prohibition?

THE PRESIDENT. Well, there are only two methods that I can think of offhand. One is for a test case to be pursued in the Federal courts to define more clearly where the options are for increased financing for black-owned publishing firms. And the other would be for corrective legislation. My guess is that in your own professional organization, a test case in the courts would be the most rapidly concluded procedure.

MR. AGURS. Mr. Betts.

PEOPLE'S TEMPLE

MR. BETTS. Mr. President, Roy Betts, Johnson Publishing Company, Ebony and Jet magazines. An estimated 600 bodies of victims, mostly black, of the Guyana cult massacre still remain at the Dover Air Force Base in Delaware, as you probably are aware. Residents there are demanding that the Government have mass cremations or burials at sea so that the cult will not build a burial shrine in that State. How can the Government bring a fitting close to this terrible chapter of violence?

THE PRESIDENT. This has been one of the most shocking and disheartening occurrences that I've ever known about. The Government, as you know, played no role in the procedure except, in a humanitarian way, to go in and to recover the bodies, to bring them back to our country. We are now trying to make maximum opportunity available for the families of those deceased persons to identify and to claim the bodies. After that effort has been exhausted and we feel sure that no additional families would come forward, then final decisions would be made on how to have appropriate burial. But at this time, Roy, I just don't know what can be done other than to encourage the families to come forward and to provide every possible opportunity for them to identify the remains of those members of their own families.

MR. BETTS. If I might follow up, Mr. President, in reference to the Government's effort to notify families, do you think that an adequate job is being done to notify families that there could be relatives among this very, very large number of people who were a part of this very tragic situation?

THE PRESIDENT. Well, I can't say that it's adequate, but we're doing the best we can. There's been a great deal of criticism of the Federal Government, by many very conservative Americans and others, for making any attempt to bring the bodies back to our country. But I felt at the time I authorized this action by the Government that it was proper. And we're doing the best we can to provide any possible identification information to the families who are searching for a lost loved one who may have been in Guyana. And although it will never be completely satisfactory, I don't know of anything else that we can do at this time.

MR. AGURS. Mr. Boone.

BLACK JUDGES

MR. BOONE. I am Ray Boone of the Afro-American Newspapers, Mr. President. Mr. President, you have promised that you would name blacks to the Federal judiciary, which remains almost all white still today. Could you give us an idea as to how many blacks you plan to name to the 152 new Federal judgeships, and particularly in the South, where there's only 1 black judge among about 1367

THE PRESIDENT. Well, my goal is to have black judges in Georgia, Florida, the Carolinas, Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana-indeed, throughout the country. As you know, in some parts of the Nation there are very few blacks who live in those States and an extremely tiny portion of the total members of the bar. We are working, though, with every Senator in the Government to encourage their submission to me of names selected by commissions, which include both women and minority representatives. And I can't give you an exact number yet, but whenever possible we will have a representative number of blacks, those who speak Spanish, and women.

One of the problems in the district judgeships is that the individual Members of the Senate, in effect, have veto power over the appointments. In circuit judgeships, I have set up my own selection panels, and I can guarantee you in the circuit judgeships that you will be well pleased.

In the district judgeships, when the Senators have refused to include in their list of recommended judges those who are black or other minorities and those who are women, then we are delaying any appointments, going back to the Senators and asking them to enlarge their list.

MR. BOONE. I take it that you are referring to Senator Byrd of Virginia, who has disagreed with your position on including minorities or blacks on the list of recommended judges.

THE PRESIDENT. He's one of several, yes.

MR. BOONE. You said you were working with all Senators. Does that include Senator Byrd?

THE PRESIDENT. Yes. The Attorney General is working with Senator Byrd and others to encourage them to expand their list of recommended nominees to include both minority representatives and women, yes.

MR. BOONE. IS he bending?

THE PRESIDENT. You could better get an answer for that from the Attorney General, who's had conversations with Senator Byrd. I've not talked to him directly. But we are making every effort we can in Virginia to encourage the selection of minority members to be judges.

I might say that in several of the Northern States we are also having a problem getting the Members of the Senate to change their longstanding policy and to make it possible for me to appoint black judges. But I'm determined to succeed.

CIA AND FBI; CONGRESSIONAL

ASSASSINATIONS INVESTIGATIONS

MR. AGURS. Mr. President, my next question is, are you satisfied that all of the people who are responsible for illegal or unethical acts by the CIA or the FBI are now out of those agencies? And are you convinced that there is no longer a possibility that a government-run campaign could be mounted to destroy or discredit a national leader in. our country?

THE PRESIDENT. I'm convinced that the leadership of the CIA and the FBI and the White House are all equally determined that there should never be a repetition of the attack on a minority leader, as was the case with Martin Luther King, Jr. And although I can't guarantee what will happen after I leave the White House, I can guarantee you that while I'm here in the White House as President, there will be no such attack on a leader as there was in the past.

MR. AGURS. In that same connection, are you satisfied that the House assassinations investigation—are you satisfied with their conclusion, and do you feel that the Justice Department now should take a look at these conspiracies that the committee feels might have existed?

THE PRESIDENT. There is no definite answer to whether or not there was a conspiracy. I think the thorough investigation, though, of all new evidence is necessary. And the FBI has publicly stated that they will pursue any new information that's available to them.

MR. AGURS. Ms. Allen.

HOSPITAL COST CONTAINMENT

Ms. ALLEN. Mr. President, in view of the fact that health care costs in the past 10 years have been such a high source of inflation, what steps are being taken to reduce the percentage of health care costs in the Federal budget, in terms of the underprivileged especially?

THE PRESIDENT. As you know, health care costs, hospital costs, have been going up—doubled every 5 years for the last 15 or so years. And unless we do something about it, hospital costs are going to double again in the next 5 years.

Last year, we mounted a major campaign in the Congress to have passed hospital cost containment legislation similar to what has already been passed in States like New York and Connecticut, which has proven so successful. Because of the extraordinary influence of the hospital lobby and the medical doctors lobby, we were not able to get this legislation passed in the House, although it did pass the Senate in modified form.

We will make another effort this year, which I believe will be successful. What we need in order to accomplish this goal is to have broad citizen understanding of how much their own best interests are involved in having a strong hospital cost containment bill passed. It would be at the top of our priorities in controlling inflation.

I think these extremely high costs are unnecessary and unwarranted, and I believe that the public is being robbed. And I hope that everyone listening to this broadcast will let their Member of the Congress in the House or Senate know that as citizens themselves, worried about their own families' future, that they join in with me in passing a strong hospital

cost containment bill this year.

MS. ALLEN. Thank you.

MR. AGURS. Mr. Briscoe.

NATIONAL ASSOCIATION FOR THE ADVANCEMENT OF COLORED PEOPLE

MR. BRISCOE. Mr. President, I'm a life member of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, the NAACP. My wife is a subscribing life member. Hundreds of thousands of Americans, black and white, have supported the NAACP. I'm sure you and Mrs. Carter have given substantial support. But as you know now, the NAACP is in a financial crisis. The Mobil Oil Company is placing ads in some of the major newspapers to help solicit funds for the organization, to save it, so it can carry on its vital functions.

What would you think of inviting Mr. Hooks ¹ down and making a presentation to him as a symbol of what can be done by all Americans to help save this organization?

¹ Executive director of the NAACP.

THE PRESIDENT. I agree with you about the importance of the NAACP continuing and also continuing as a strong and well-financed organization. Benjamin Hooks was here at this very table last month. And he comes to meet with me often to pursue the goals of the NAACP.

I think one of the things that can be done is, through broadcasts like this, to let the people of our Nation know, both black and white, how important I, as President, believe that a strong NAACP is to the future of our country and the protection of minority rights.

Many people feel that the major battles for civil rights have been won in our country, which is certainly not the case. We need to be constantly vigilant about encroachments on the freedom and quality of life of poor people, in general, and of minority poor who have compounded their problems. And I think that everyone listening to this program can certainly afford the $5 membership fee for the NAACP, and I would encourage them to send in their contribution to make sure this organization is strong and viable.

I've noticed in recent days that the NAACP leadership has begun turning more and more to corporate contributions to support the NAACP. This is obviously necessary to prevent a curtailment of the staffing and the efforts of the organization. But the best source of NAACP funds still remains the small, concerned private member, who only contributes $5 a year but, in that contribution, becomes a part of the NAACP effort. And as President, without violating the nonbiased point of view of the Oval Office, I would like to encourage a stronger membership in the NAACP of all those who are listening.

MR. AGURS. Mr. Betts.

SOUTHERN AFRICA

MR. BETTS. Mr. President, you should be commended for your crusading pledges for human rights and peace throughout the world. However, the racial condition in southern Africa doesn't seem to improve, even though the news media and the Government seem to overlook the circumstances in favor of news in other parts of the world. Do you expect to take a firm stand in improving the racial conditions in southern Africa, beyond what we've seen now?

THE PRESIDENT. I believe that under Andy Young's leadership as a strong and unrestrained vocal leader in the United Nations, we have materially improved our own Nation's position with respect to the majority of citizens who live in Africa, that is, the black citizens. And I think we've been relatively successful, compared to previous records of our own country. We have an immediate prospect for success in having a majority government established in Namibia. And we've exerted every effort, along with other members of the United Nations, particularly the leadership from Canada, Great Britain, France, and Germany, working in harmony, to bring about the move by South Africa to withdraw their own influence from Namibia and let the people who live there choose on a one-person-one-vote basis the majority government.

In addition, working closely with the British, and also through, of course, Andy Young and others, we've tried to bring together the National Front the present government of Rhodesia and the frontline governments surrounding Rhodesia-to have a majority government established in that country, which would then be called Zimbabwe, based on a one-person-one-vote representation. We haven't made much progress there, although I think all three of those entities that I named are looking for some continued leadership from the United States and, particularly, Great Britain. We deplore apartheid and any sort of racial discrimination, and we strongly support the establishment of majority rule government in South Africa. We have made this clear to the Botha government and continue to pursue that goal.

I think, in general, the progress has been detectable and sound. In my opinion, it's been too slow, but we are determined. And I think we have at least been successful in arousing among the black leaders of Africa an increasing degree of confidence in our own Government when, for decades, even generations, we have stayed aloof from any movement toward majority rule, black rule in Africa.

So, I think we made good progress, slow progress, but we'll be very consistent through Andy Young and other leaders in pursuing these goals that I've described to you.

MR. BETTS. One brief followup. Would you consider a followup trip to your earlier trip to Nigeria or some other part of Africa in the near future?

THE PRESIDENT. Not in the near future, but I'd like very much to go back to Africa again and to travel in countries that I was not able to visit before. In the meantime, of course, we've had many of the top leaders from Africa come here and meet with me. And I think that as a result of this there's been a much better understanding. So, yes, I would like very much to go back to Africa again.

MR. AGURS. Mr. Boone.

PRESIDENTIAL ADVISERS ON BLACK ISSUES

MR. BOONE. Mr. President, I would like to know who is your top adviser on concerns of the black community? I'd like to know whether this person is black. I ask this question, because I have seen a number of lists published which show your top advisers, but never is there a black person. So, could you comment on that, please?

THE PRESIDENT. Well, one thing that I've tried to avoid is any arrangement within the White House or within my Cabinet advisers where only a black person can be responsible for improving the quality of life of the black citizens of our country. Louis Martin works very closely with me here in the White House on matters that relate directly to black persons alone.

But I would like to point out that I consider myself to be a good spokesman for the well-being of black citizens. I think I could not possibly have a better Vice President than Fritz Mondale, whether that Vice President was black or white. And I believe that every member of my domestic and foreign counselors are strongly oriented, as am I, toward the improvement of the life of minority citizens in this country.

If I should ever have any proven allegations that this is not the case with a single Cabinet member or any of my advisers, I would discharge them immediately. And I hope that the minority citizens of our country don't feel that when they have a special problem that relates to the United States Government, that they have to find a black person to listen to them. I'm available, and I hope that every member of my staff, every member of my Cabinet feels the same way.

BLACK SUPPORT FOR THE PRESIDENT

MR. BOONE. Mr. President, a followup. You proved your credibility in the black community 2 years ago when you won 90 percent of the vote. But times change and, of course, the degree of credibility changes.

THE PRESIDENT. Yes.

MR. BOONE. You're in midterm now. My question is, if you decide to run, and I understand you have made a decision to that effect, do you think you could pull a repeat 90-percent performance in an election, considering the heavy criticism that you have received from the black community, particularly in the area of unemployment and the budget? Could I have a response to that, please?

THE PRESIDENT. Mr. Boone, let me say that I think my record on the unemployment and budget is very good. But I don't take anything for granted. Certainly, I don't take for granted an automatic support by the black citizens of our country just because I'm a Democrat or just because I've been in office or just because I got good support 2 years ago. My effort will be continuing the next 2 ),ears to do a good job, so that whether I am the next President or not, the black citizens of our country would say, "Jimmy Carter was a friend of ours as long as he was in the White House." So, I want to run on my record, if I run, and not based on any sort of assumption that I will get support from the black community just because of who I am or what I've done.

PRESIDENT'S 1980 CANDIDACY

MR. BOONE. One followup, Mr. President. Have you decided whether you would run, and would you share that with us? In 1980, are you going to run?

THE PRESIDENT. I've decided, but I haven't decided when I'm going to announce my decision.

1980 BUDGET

MR. AGURS. The last question, Mr. President, is do you foresee a serious congressional challenge to your budget-making decisions and that is why you've put on additional lobbying strengths? And also, if so, do you think the lawmakers would be more interested in increasing your social and domestic expenditures? What is your assessment?

THE PRESIDENT. I've worked the last 12 months on this 1980 fiscal year budget. And I believe, Mr. Agurs, that it's a good budget. Obviously, it's going to be 5 or 6 months, at least, before the Congress takes final action on the budget I propose. And during that 5 or 6 months or more, economic circumstances will change, estimates of revenue and expenditures will become much more accurate, and there might be some modifications to the budget that I, myself, would propose to the Congress, as I have the 2 preceding years.

But I believe that the Congress will find, in general, this to be a fair budget, a responsible budget, and a very enlightened budget.

As I said earlier, in allocation of funds for civil rights, we will have substantial increases; for minority businesses, substantial increases; for allocations of funds for the poor, substantial increases in 1980, about the same as we had between '78 and '79. And I believe that if the Congress does make any changes, they will be relatively minor.

We'll be monitoring this very closely, because I would not stand idly by and see the Congress take funds away from those who need Federal assistance most and give it to those less worthy. So, we'll be monitoring it closely. But I think it's a good, sound budget and, in general, the Congress will approve.

MR. AGURS. Thank you, Mr. President.

THE PRESIDENT. Thank you. I have enjoyed it very much, Don. I thank all of you for letting me be with you.